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TRANSCRIPT OF RADIO PROGRAM INTERVIEW
WITH JEB BRUGMANN FROM RIO+5
BY Joan Veon

Joan:

I recently attended the "Rio plus Five" Conference in Rio de Janeiro which was held March 13 - 20. The purpose of this conference was to assess where the whole United Nations environmental agenda was with regard to implementation by the nations and people of the world. The Rio Earth Summit was held five years ago in the same city.

Interestingly enough, I was able to understand the major players who are orchestrating what we call, "World Government or The New World Order. " There are agents on all levels. The global, national and local level. We will be discussing the global and national levels, and then concentrating specifically on a group which is working at the local level to implement a radical environmental agenda which will not only change our way of life, but our freedoms and dreams, our form of government and everything else that is related to freedom.

I will be mentioning people who are spearheading the whole environmental agenda, major global organizations who are leading it on the global level, how it is being spearheaded on the national level and lastly, we will end this week with an interview with a man who has orchestrated the environmental movement on the local level. A number of people in key positions who were at the Conference are:

Maurice Strong

A Canadian, has spearheaded the whole environmental movement. He has net worked, maneuvered, orchestrated and connected non-governmental organizations, major corporations and the UN. He is special advisor to both S-G Kofi Annan and the President of the World Bank, James Wolfensohn. He is the globalists' globalist. He is Chairman of the Earth Council, Chairman of the World Resource Institute, Foundation Director of the World Economic Forum.

Secretary-General of the first earth summit in 1972, Executive Director of the UN Environmental Programme in Nairobi, Kenya, and the Rio earth summit in 1992 and as chairman of the Earth Council, presided at the Rio +5 Conference. He is also director of the Rockefeller Foundation and a member of the Brundtland Commission and The Commission on Global Governance.

He is a friend of Michael Gorbachev and works closely with him on many global environmental matters.

He and Michael Gorbachev co-chaired this meeting in Rio.

Wally N'Dow - Secretary General of the UN Conference on Human Settlements - Habitat II

The first Habitat Conference said that personal property rights were in the way of equity and peace.

Those ideas are still part of the UN agenda. In an interview with him in Rio, he said that Habitat "quote was not just a housing conference, it was...a debate of the cities and the urban challenge."

He went on to say that there were subject that were taboo in the UN in 1976 at the time of the first Habitat conference. He elaborated, quote One could not discuss subjects such as the role of the private sector because we were still in the grips of the Cold War with ideologies contending over what was capitalist, socialist, what was acceptable in the UN fora and what could not be discussed---private sector and land--who owns it, how it is managed--these were things that could not be discussed. In Istanbul we were able to go beyond those and the barriers came down and the debate included not only government but local authorities, mayors were there in a big way..."

Bella Abzug - Very left wing Congresswoman from New York who worked on the Clean Air and Water Act back in 1972. She now directs and orchestrates the women's movement in the UN.

Jonathan Lash - President of the World Resources Institute and Co-Chair, U.S. President's Council on Sustainable Development The World Resource Institute is heavily supported and considered the richest of the environmental NGO's as its main support comes from the Rockefellers, along with the Mellons and MacArthur Foundations. The current Director of the UNDP, James Gustave Speth, was a former chairman of World Resources Institute.

The President's Commission on Sustainable Development - set up by Executive Order in 1993 - to basically implement the environmental agenda and the philosophy of sustainable development into all areas of society in America. My home town, Racine, Wisconsin, is now a "sustainable city."

Global Groups/Organizations - Important to the change of life and politics on Planet Earth include:

The World Trade Organization, The International Chamber of Commerce

The World Bank, The World Economic Forum

The World Business Council for Sustainable Development -

-----------------------------------------------

From the top down, these groups are spearheading a global environmental shift in society, business, education, policies and religion. Let us take a look at each one.

World Trade Organization - GATT - Free Trade

This organization - every country is given one vote....there is equality - the U.S. is equal to Cuba or Brazil or Pakistan or Hong Kong, to name a few of our neighbors. All trade disputes will be heard before the WTO and a panel of unbiased attorneys and jurists will hear and determine international trade law.

International Chamber of Commerce

The ICCs purpose is to promote international trade, investment and the market economy system. It makes rules that govern the conduct of business across borders. It provides essential services such as the ICC International Court of Arbitration.

It was founded in 1919 by "handful of farsighted business leaders." I believe Rockefeller was one of them. It has thousands of members companies and associations from over 130 countries. national committees throughout the world present ICC views to their governments and coordinate with their membership to address the concerns of the business community. Local chamber of commerces from all over the U.S. support the ICC with their dues.

ICC has top-level consultative status with the UN where it puts forth the view of business. It maintains close relations with the WTO, Organization for Economic Co-operation and Development (OECD) and other intergovernmental bodies. It also works with the host government of the G-7 Economic Summit.

ATT AMEXCO ABB 3M Chevro

Bayer British Gas Brit. Petro. Brit Tel Enron

East-Kodak DuPont Dow Corning IBM

Coca-Cola Ford Fiat GM GE

McDonald MCI Merck Mobil Nabisco

Philips Pepsico Nynex Price Waterhouse

Texaco Toyota Sony Time-Warner

The World Economic Council for Sustainable Development

Is a coalition of international companies united by a shared commitment to the environment and to the principles of economic growth and sustainable development. Have 120 members from the world's best- known and respected companies from 34 countries. They also have regional councils and partner organizations representing more than 600- countries.

The WBCSD was formed in January 1995 through a merger between the Business Council for Sustainable Development in Geneva and the World Industry Council for the Environment (WICE) in Paris. The WBCSD is becoming the pre-eminent business voice on sustainable development issues.

ATT ABB British Gas British Petroleum

Delta Dow DuPont Eastman Kodak

Fiat GM 3M Sony

Nestle Phillips S.C. Johnson & son Shell

Texaco Toshiba Volvo Xerox

The World Bank -

They are not a Friend of the Republic but are a global organization. Many of the third world

countries are deeply indebted to the World Bank and they have used this to financially blackmail these countries into accepting the programme of action for these their world countries. The world Bank has and is spearheading sustainable development and the environment into all that it does and is basically now demanding that any loans to countries have an environmental component in it which will dig the hole of debt further for any country desiring a loan.

The World Economic Forum

The World Economic Forum has been meeting for 27 years and about 2000 leaders of countries and companies come together to discuss world issues. In January, 1997, world leaders included European Commission President Jacques Santer, Prime Minister Chernomyrdin, Nelson Mandela, Benjamin Netanyahu and Yasser Arafat. Their talks are based on launching a single currency in 1999 for Europe.

Central Bankers included members of the Bank of France, the Bundesbank and the Bank of England besides the U.S. Treasury, Bank of Japan and the European Common Market. In addition the World Bank and WTO and Newt Ginrich were present.

The President's Commission on Sustainable Development

Issued special report, "The Road to Sustainable Development: A Snapshot of Activities in the United States of America," March, 1997 - 1-202-408-5296.

How Change Policy, Law, government, Life, Education, Religion, on the National Level?

Agenda 21 from the Rio Earth Summit called for "National Councils on Sustainable Development" to be set up in each country. These Councils would spearhead the rest of the changes and set up the national mechanisms and infrastructure to change policy, law, life education, and religion on a national level.

"The President's Council on Sustainable Development welcomes the Earth Council's leadership and efforts to integrate the experiences of all sectors and countries in pursuing sustainability."

"Since UNCED, more than 100 countries have established national councils on sustainable development or other institutional mechanisms for developing policy recommendations or monitoring progress toward sustainability."

"This documents describes a small sample of the sustainability efforts we have encountered. The chapters are organized by sector--business, NGO, academic institutions, then by regions, states and localities which they say is "artificial since many of the efforts involve partnerships. In fact, the very nature of sustainable development means that success will ultimately depend on interdisciplinary approaches and multi-stakerholder participation." With regard to the role and importance of public- private partnerships, the Report, states, "How can we best encourage the efforts that are underway and foster new initiatives? The Council believes that part of the answer lies in leadership from the private sector, governments, NGOs, and citizens. It will require new institutions, such as the Joint Center for Sustainable Communities and the Northwest Regional Council, that can translate the abstract concepts of sustainable development into tangible results at the local, state and regional levels."

Then we are confronted with how the whole environmental agenda is going to come down on a local level. I submit to you an interview which I had with Jeff Brugmann who is Secretary-General of the International Council for Environmental and Local Initiatives or ICELI, located in Toronto, Canada.

ICELI is not a religious group in any sense of the imagination. I believe a more accurate term for them would be "change agents." Their philosophy is, from what I could gather, socialist. They are looking to change the world, and in our case, since we live in America, from the bottom up. I liked Jeff Brugmann. I found him to be extremely articulate, kind, neat and very misguided. He is Jewish but appears to have forgotten some of the basic tenants of the Jewish faith as he has embraced Socialism, is a friend of communism and is committed to changing America from the local level up.

My first question to him was to ask him about the early beginnings of how ICELI, which was started in 1990, got established.

Jeb Brugmann (JB): Throughout the 1980s, local government officials, about 600 of them, organized in a network called "Local Elected officials for Social Responsibility" and their concern at that time was primarily addressing the local impacts and the international development impacts of government foreign policy. You may remember cities declaring themselves as sanctuaries for refugees from El Salvador and Guatemala, divesting from South Africa, establishing sister-city relations with the Soviet Union and this movement built and demonstrated the capacity of local governments to have an impact in international affairs so when the Cold War came to an end, we, in the movement, decided that we had to identify the next phase of activities for local government involvement and it was clear at that time that we should focus on the global environment.

JV:

1. 600 local government officials - out of perhaps 10,000 in the U.S. or less than 1% started a network called - "Local Elected Officials for Social Responsibility." We are not talking a crocheting society here, we are talking a socialist movement.

2. Activities: Divesting from South Africa due to apartheid and establishing sister city

relationships with the Soviet Union - during the Cold War. - What does that

say to you?

3. He calls what they did a "movement" and it is. It is a socialist movement to find ways to merge aspects of America with Russia.

4. Had success: Demonstrated the capacity of local governments to have an impact on

international affairs.

When the Cold War ended, they identified their next phase of activities as being ON THE GLOBAL

ENVIRONMENTAL LEVEL. If his organization was set up in 1980's they were testing out the ability of the local level to affect from the bottom up approach.

Interestingly enough, Patrick Buchanan wrote an article in The Washington Times, date March 31, 1997 in which he writes:

"In Foreign Affairs magazine in 1974, diplomat Richard Gardner offered his fellow

globalists advice on how to bring American around to embracing world government.

It would have to be done, he wrote, by stealth: "[T] he house of world order will

have to be built from the bottom up...an end run around national sovereignty,

eroding it piece by piece, will accomplish much more than the old-fashioned frontal

assault."

What we are seeing is a strong grass roots movement at the local level to change society and our laws. Listen to the next excerpt.

JB: In 1989 , a group of 30 American cities gathered at the American Academy of Sciences and Engineering with Sherwood Rolands, who is a chemist who received the Nobel prize for discovering the depletion of the ozone layer and we held a meeting to determine how cities in the United States could implement the Montreal Protocol to phase out CFC's at a time when the Bush administration was unwilling to include language in the Clean Air Act to actually put the Montreal Protocol into effect. These 35 cities passed local ordinances to phase out CFC's in a very rapid time schedule.

JV: 1. Sherwood Rolands, who received a Nobel prize for discovering the Depletion of the Ozone layer did not discover the depletion of the Ozone Layer as the environmentalist would have you

believe. According to true science, and not science who finds a theory and then tries to support it, there is no climate warming--or ozone depletion. This is being used as an excuse to bring in a radical environmental agenda, global taxation and a shift in the philosophy of governing.

2. The Montreal Protocol was the first environmental concepts to be pushed by the United Nations. What he said was they got 35 cities to pass local ordinances to phase out CFC's in a rapid time schedule.

He goes on to say that the efforts of his group his the news media, opposing George Bush who would not include the Depletion of the Ozone Layer in the Clean Air Act which signified that the cities could lead over the governments--that they had that kind of power.

Because of this "Power," his organization, he says, came to the attention of the United Nations Environmental Programme to work with them to see if they could play a similar role in other environmental accords.

In this next clip, he tells of his surprise. Listen to how he phrases his movement.

JB: We surprised, because we were aware that we were having an impact but we never thought of a direct relationship between local government and the U.S. which is an organization of countries. I got involved with local government in the early 1980s as part of this broader peace and human rights movement.

JV: --Jeb Bruggman is a socialist - he says that he was surprised to be invited by the

United Nations Environment Programme, UNEP because they were affecting change

from the local level to the international level.

My first impression of the agenda that I saw in Istanbul at the Habitat II conference was that the " philosophical war" we are in the midst of will be fought in our neighborhoods. Jeb Bruggman describes the Local government as part of a "broader peace and human rights movement."

Currently these philosophical wars are being fought in our schools, the sex ed programs

but they are coming on a larger environmental level to your neighborhood soon and Jeb

tells us about it in this next clip.

JB: That was the pilot test experience to determine if people acting locally could actually influence international policy of governments and could have an impact internationally and we found that we were having impacts. Cities divested 10's if not hundreds of millions of dollars from businesses involved in South Africa. That had an impact. That brought it tot he state level. From the state level, as they divested, it brought it to the Congress and eventually Congress changed its policy.

JV: Jeb Brugmann, a socialist, who heads up a grassroots environmental group to impact at the local and city level has just described the kind of impact and success his group has had in changing social and environmental policy at the local level and then in Congress. Maybe those of us who are opposed to this kind of change should take note. We can't change anything if we are sitting on the couch. The battle is in the Board of Education meetings, the City Planning and County council meetings. Do you know what is going on in your neighborhood?

In this next clip, Jeb tells about how they were then able to facilitate and assist with the implementation of a radical international policy on the local level.

JB: Now we are able to plan ahead a bit more rather than react to an international policy in figuring out what we can do with it. We get engaged in the design of that policy. As the United Nations is right now negotiating an international treaty on dealing with the Climate Change problem, the cities are the table. In the U.S. 45 cities have joined an international "Cities for Climate Protection Campaign" and their commitment as participants in that campaign is to develop a local action plan to reduce their greenhouse gas emissions. The U.S. EPA is giving full support to this activity financially and in other ways and in fact, the cities are reporting to the U.S. EPA on their emissions reduction so the U.S. Government can go to the international arena and claim that the U.S. is complying with its treaty commitments. So we are now at the starting point of engaging in a process with the United Nations and governments in actually designing the policies that we can implement locally in order to achieve global environmental accords and we will be doing the same with Climate, Agenda 21, endorsed a major international campaign called "Local Agenda 21" whereby now more than 2000 cities in more than 60 countries around the world are developing Agenda 21's for their cities with concrete targets, with concrete budgets on how they are going to implement these things and this is a movement that is now beginning in the U.S. Out of the 4000 or so cities and towns in the United States, there are now only 19 formally in this Local Agenda 21 activities.

JV: Let us take a look at what Jeb Bruggman has described. They have been so successful in changing national policy from the local level that now the U.S. EPA - is giving them full support - I verified with him--direct financial support--to his group to spearhead a change on the local level to IMPLEMENT LOCALLY GLOBAL ENVIRONMENTAL ACCORDS WITHOUT IT GOING THROUGH OUR CONGRESS.

YOU TALK ABOUT AN END RUN AROUND OUR CONSTITUTION AND OUR GOVERNING PROCESS. LET ME REPEAT WHAT ICELI--A SOCIALIST ENVIRONMENTAL GROUP IS DOING ON THE LOCAL LEVEL --- IMPLEMENTING LOCALLY GLOBAL ENVIRONMENTAL ACCORDS WITHOUT THEM BEING PASSED BY CONGRESS.

JV: The cities which ICELI are making progress and part of the Local Agenda 21 activities are:

Seattle, Santa Monica, San Francisco, Chattanooga and Tacoma Park, MD.

Let's listen to Jeb Bruggman talk about the greater environmental agenda:

JB: Environmentalists have always thought that saving the planet is about creating new parks, protecting wilderness areas, things that are outside of the lives of the average people in the United States. The City, because of its concentration, allows us to economically invest in the infrastructure we need in order to protect the environment as well as social services. It is be creating high density that we can finance public transportation systems, recycling systems, all of these things so we want to reap the opportunity of the city to protect the environment.

Our job since the Summit has been to make sure that local government is aware of its responsibilities in implementing that plan and that it has the resources and the support to do. What does it mean? Local governments needs to create a mechanism in which they work with the business community, the non-profit organizations, the civic sector to develop strategies to implement the different chapters of Agenda 21--dealing with issues like protection of the atmosphere, water resources, biological diversity, changing consumption patterns, sustainable agriculture--all of these areas mentioned in Agenda 21.

Well, as most people know in their cities, if there isn't a good relationship between the residents of the town or the businesses of the town and the local government, not much gets done.

JV: This is a grass roots movement -- from the bottom up and what it requires is something the world Bank calls "Social Capital" --the ability of people to think alike. Social capital is what holds the fabric of society together.....and they aren't talking Christianity. What is the key to the ground up? PUBLIC PRIVATE PARTNERSHIPS.

JB: We're trying to overcome this by taking a partnership strategy to implementation and in may cities, particularly those that are doing this local Agenda 21 process in the U.S. What they do is create multi-sectoral councils or organizations where local government representatives, business, the church community, the union community, the non-profit community meet together to flesh out a common strategy in areas where they can agree with one another and make joint agreements to implement that strategy.

JV: The whole key to the New World Order and the shift in power from the Constitution to a new form of government or governance is PUBLIC PRIVATE PARTNERSHIPS. I then ask him why it has taken until 1972 to do something about the environment. His answer is quite revealing.

JB: Why we haven't done something sooner is an interesting question. I like to say, in a historical context that we spent most of the 20th century arguing over two doctrines of development. There is the socialist doctrine of development and the capitalist doctrine of development and we spent all our resources battling between these two doctrines. We had the Cold War, we had real wars. I mean, hundreds of billions of dollars. And, it wasn't until the Cold War came to an end, 1987 the World Commission on Environment Development put forward a third doctrine called sustainable development which is about balancing between social equity, the long time socialist concern, economic vitality, the capitalist concern and then this new concern that neither paid any attention to which is environmental sustainability. So, we have a new concept for how to develop now and we're just beginning to learn how to put it into practice.

Comments by Joan Veon, off tape:

This is a pretty revealing interview. The whole world view of the U.S. Government is laid bare, especially when a group like ICELI is being financed by the EPA to create/orchestrate interest on the local level for major U.N. environmental treaties which will give away our sovereignty and put the American people into bondage. If we do not wake up now, when we do, it will be too late!!!!